Let's Talk BBQ
General => General Discussion & Topics => General Discussion => Topic started by: PatioDaddio on February 05, 2013, 09:12:17 PM
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Tune in now to BBQ Central Radio show. Or, hit up the podcast tomorrow.
http://outdoorcookingchannel.com/watch-now (http://outdoorcookingchannel.com/watch-now)
John
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Do I want to know what BBQ judges want? In a word....no. Anyone who cooks ribs, chicken, pulled pork and brisket for a living and doesnt do it well are morons. What I would like to do is go up against these pitmasters and make four dishes NOT using the these mandatory cooks. Bring it on Myron!
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Do I want to know what BBQ judges want? In a word....no.
ya, i agree w/ rickyB.
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The judges round table was interesting show segment, hearing how it works, what they look for, etc. But in all honesty the judges at my backyard BBQ's (i.e. family and friends) are who count for me....
And they love ribs that are fall off the bone tender! 8)
And so do I! :P
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Do I want to know what BBQ judges want? In a word....no. Anyone who cooks ribs, chicken, pulled pork and brisket for a living and doesnt do it well are morons. What I would like to do is go up against these pitmasters and make four dishes NOT using the these mandatory cooks. Bring it on Myron!
OK, this post clearly isn't for you. Sorry.
I'll let you know when the KCBS starts their Chopped series. ::)
John
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Do I want to know what BBQ judges want? In a word....no. Anyone who cooks ribs, chicken, pulled pork and brisket for a living and doesnt do it well are morons. What I would like to do is go up against these pitmasters and make four dishes NOT using the these mandatory cooks. Bring it on Myron!
OK, this post clearly isn't for you. Sorry.
I'll let you know when the KCBS starts their Chopped series. ::)
John
Sorry John if you took this the wrong way. Was just saying I would rather be a good chef than a good pitmaster. I love great BBQ but the current crop of television shows imho does not show great cooking skills. If all I had to do was cook the same thing over and over again by a set of standards applied by a set of judges that even the pittmasters say are, and I must agree, dont know what their doing, where is the challenge? As much as we would all like to think, cooking bbq is not a skill reserved for the gifted. It's been done for thousands of years. In this day and age a couple of google searches and the ability to read will get you half way there. Add a decent cooker and you can put out some good Q. In my opinion comp bbq is way over rated. A great chef can cook great BBQ...a great pitmaster can ONLY cook great BBQ.
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Do you feel that the judges are preserving a standard or stifling creativity? In the first case, you care what they are looking for. In the second, you don't. The competitions are always fun to watch, but I'd prefer to see who pleases the taste of the masses over who meets certain standards.
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Sorry if this is getting a bit off topic, but...
A great chef can cook great BBQ...a great pitmaster can ONLY cook great BBQ.
I guess it depends on what you think of when you think "Pitmaster." When I think "Pitmaster" it's what your calling a chef (or outdoor chef/cook). He or she goes beyond competition style cooking and truly "masters" the pit bringing skills other than just the four low & slow comp-style meats.
As a matter of fact...
What I would like to do is go up against these pitmasters and make four dishes NOT using the these mandatory cooks. Bring it on Myron!
...that's exactly why I personally liked Season 2 of "BBQ Pitmasters." While they had some typical comp-style cooking, the competitors had to go beyond that and show some REAL pitmaster skills, creativity and come up with, not only side dishes, but also the sidewinder challenge where they had to cook something outside their normal realm.
To me THAT is a REAL pitmaster. It's what we do in our own back yards and share right here on this forum.
Am I making sense (it's very late)?
Cliff
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As I've mentioned before, competition barbeque is great but not necessarily the best barbeque. Competition "styles" develop due to competitors chasing trends and "what won last week". That's the bad news. The good news is that those styles evolve and I've seen interesting developments and movements in competition cooking over my term as a judge.
"Pitmasters" is an interesting show, but, one must remember that reality TV isn't. The producers slant the presentation to get rating points and, in the process, don't present a true picture of what's going on.
Lots of contests have other categories (desserts, beans, miscellaneous sides) in addition to the main four meats. The Kansas City Royal (which I got to judge two years ago) had some mind-blowing and incredibly creative non-traditional categories.
What do judges want? If you really want to know the best way to find out is to take a judging class ;D
Hub
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One of the plans for LTBBQ is to continue developing areas of the site that appeal to folks that have interest in trying out BBQ competition. We are firstly a "backyard BBQ site" but that does not mean that we can't learn some things form the folks that compete - and likewise, from the judging of such competition.
There is room for all opinions, and and all goals.
Example: If you look at Barry's ( CB) "Welcome to the Cookout!" section - you will see that it appeals to working with the basics to make some really great food. Many that are new to outdoor cooking grilling/BBQ would find a lot there to enjoy.
Barry has had an entire career involved in showing folks how good - and non-complicated food can be on the grill.
Likewise - Hub's section titled: "Hub's repository for all things BBQ related" takes folks further into the details of "backyard to competition" thinking. Many have at least daydreamed if only momentarily about competing, but lacked the confidence or understanding of the rules and conditions, or what judges like to see and taste.
Hub has quite a storied history in being a senior judge at the biggest BBQ competitions in the KCBS.
So - we have a great deal of talent here, including all of our members. But - we all should think about looking "outside the box" occasionally so that we continue to grow and improve on what we already know. That is part of the fun for most of us.
Whether or not you have aspirations of cooking for trophies - or compliments from your wife - the possibliity of learning a trick or two may be worth a few minutes of your time ;).
T
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I have a hard enough time trying to figure out what my family wants ;D They are the toughest of all judges :( Backyard rules 8)
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i know that alot of ppl compete on the bbq circuit. and i think thats great. its a hard thing to do everyweek and it is expensive also. my hats off to them. but, comp cooks and 90% of the rest of us backyard ppl don't cook the for the same results. comp cook have 1 bite to impress judges. me, i know my food is 10 times better then whatever anybody can get out of a bbq place around here. ribs, butts, chuckies, chickens, fish are all better in the backyard. i'm not trying to impress anybody and i know my flavor profiles will be fine for everyone eating my bbq. can i learn from comp cooks? yes. i would like to learn the little secrets that they have? yes, but really. in to many forums around the internet comp cooks think of themselves as gods sometimes. it gets old. ok, i guess i need another espresso. sorry for this. if it bothers anyone plz delete this post of mine. 8)
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I have a hard enough time trying to figure out what my family wants ;D They are the toughest of all judges :( Backyard rules 8)
AMEN! My wife makes the most critical panel of judges look like pussycats :)
Hub
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While listening to the show the other evening, one interesting thing I did learn, that blew my mind, was that "bite-through" chicken skin is NOT a rule or requirement for chicken, yet many judges do score down on it. A real head scratcher! :(
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i know that alot of ppl compete on the bbq circuit. and i think thats great. its a hard thing to do everyweek and it is expensive also. my hats off to them. but, comp cooks and 90% of the rest of us backyard ppl don't cook the for the same results. comp cook have 1 bite to impress judges. me, i know my food is 10 times better then whatever anybody can get out of a bbq place around here. ribs, butts, chuckies, chickens, fish are all better in the backyard. i'm not trying to impress anybody and i know my flavor profiles will be fine for everyone eating my bbq. can i learn from comp cooks? yes. i would like to learn the little secrets that they have? yes, but really. in to many forums around the internet comp cooks think of themselves as gods sometimes. it gets old. ok, i guess i need another espresso. sorry for this. if it bothers anyone plz delete this post of mine. 8)
Well put and good point, Sparky. I love to tell folks that the best barbeque in town is at my house and you can say the same in your burg. Time, effort and love go into what we all cook in the backyard. As for competition, its fun and I love to judge and compete but it doesn't necessarily improve anyone's cooking skills. It's just another interesting aspect of the hobby (like making sausage -- oh, lordy don't tell me what you put in that ???).
Hub
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While listening to the show the other evening, one interesting thing I did learn, that blew my mind, was that "bite-through" chicken skin is NOT a rule or requirement for chicken, yet many judges do score down on it. A real head scratcher! :(
Correctamundo -- it has never been a requirement. In fact, it isn't even a requirement to leave the skin on the chicken. The only "requirement" is that judges must taste the skin if it is included in the entry. I support this rule because the skin has and contributes a lot of flavor and the judge needs to experience it even though he or she might not be a "skin eater" by preference -- preferences have no place in judging. Judges who mark down for tough skin are not totally erring, however. Entries are judged for Appearance, Taste and Tenderness. A judge who encounters tough skin on a piece of chicken (although the meat itself might be tender) and downgrades the Tenderness rating is not without basis. As a judge I'm kind of lenient on this and as long as I can get a bite of the skin without having to gnaw on it like a pet poodle to dislodge the bit, I'm okay. As a cook I think of "bite thru skin" as a pathway or convenience factor toward a good Tenderness score ;D
Hub
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Sorry John if you took this the wrong way. Was just saying I would rather be a good chef than a good pitmaster. I love great BBQ but the current crop of television shows imho does not show great cooking skills. If all I had to do was cook the same thing over and over again by a set of standards applied by a set of judges that even the pittmasters say are, and I must agree, dont know what their doing, where is the challenge? As much as we would all like to think, cooking bbq is not a skill reserved for the gifted. It's been done for thousands of years. In this day and age a couple of google searches and the ability to read will get you half way there. Add a decent cooker and you can put out some good Q. In my opinion comp bbq is way over rated. A great chef can cook great BBQ...a great pitmaster can ONLY cook great BBQ.
No offense taken. The judging I was referring to (and was discussed on Greg's show) is KCBS judging. I don't know how the conversation shifted to television judging, but they don't use KCBS standards/rules. Frankly, all of the BBQ Pitmasters seasons except season one have sucked royally. Sure, I watch them, but man it's a train wreck.
I agree that competition barbecue is overrated, but it's also very difficult to do well.
John
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Thanks John for sticking up for Season 1! Season 1 was the best. It showed some of the many challenges of cooking on the circuit. About once a year we pull out a couple of big barrel grills at work and I grill burgers and dogs for all the employees and I am a little out of sorts not being on my patio where everything is familiar, so I can just imagine how difficult being on the competition circuit can be. It aint as good as backyard but the excellent Que that is produced under very difficult situations must be applauded........