Let's Talk BBQ
Recipes => Recipes => Pork Recipes => Topic started by: deestafford on February 08, 2014, 01:04:32 PM
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When BBQ judges are talking about the "money muscle" of the butt where is exactly is it and how do you identify it after the butt is cooked and how do you separate it from the rest of the butt?
Dee
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Real good question Dee?
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I want to know too.
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I want to know too.
X2
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Dee wasn't that your nickname in college? :P
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Dee, the money muscle is on the opposite side of the bone. I don't do anything special
with it other than cook the whole butt. I am not into competitions but I understand that
they cube the money muscle for their turn-in boxes.
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HOS, Thanks. Now I understand. When the competitors are preparing their plates for turn in they slice the money muscle up nice and pretty cause it seems to have a nice shape like a pork tenderloin.
Mike, You're right on the money. Still am. But taker numbers have reduced drastically...very drastically.
Dee
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The bone actually points at the money muscle (it is the corner). I do not complete, but I still like to slice the money muscle. My wife likes sliced better than pulled, so... The catch is that your money muscle is ready to slice (around 180 degrees for me) before the rest of your butt is ready to pull. There are a couple of ways to combat this. You can take out the butt and slice off the money muscle then return the butt to the cooker. What I typically do though is put the money muscle side into a colder spot in the cooker and pull the whole butt out at once. Typically I get about that 20 degree difference from end to end that I am looking for.
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Although a newbie to this website (actually my first post), I think I may have some insight from a competitors stand point. The money muscle is almost a needed part to a turn in box in KCBS competitions. On the opposite side of the bone, you will notice a loin that almost looks like the grain runs perpendicular to the table the butt sits on...this is the "Money Muscle". I personally sculpt the muscle out and cook it until it reaches 190 to 194 degrees. At this point, the butt needs to rest for at least 2 hours so that all the juices don't run out when slicing into it. This website does a great job explaining the cut view of a pork butt.
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Although a newbie to this website (actually my first post), I think I may have some insight from a competitors stand point. The money muscle is almost a needed part to a turn in box in KCBS competitions. On the opposite side of the bone, you will notice a loin that almost looks like the grain runs perpendicular to the table the butt sits on...this is the "Money Muscle". I personally sculpt the muscle out and cook it until it reaches 190 to 194 degrees. At this point, the butt needs to rest for at least 2 hours so that all the juices don't run out when slicing into it. This website does a great job explaining the cut view of a pork butt.
http://www.thepickledpig.com/forums/printthread.php?t=1252&page=1 (http://www.thepickledpig.com/forums/printthread.php?t=1252&page=1)
Wow that's a heck of a way to start your first post. That article is very good reading.
Many Thanks and a Big Welcome from Manitoba Canada ;D
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Thanks for the compliment CDN. I have to apologize, i modified my original post because it referenced another forum which was brought to my attention. I posted the link because thats how I and many other competitors learned about the different muscles of a pork butt and couldnt have said it better than that original poster.
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Welcome from Minnesota
Paul
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It is fine to mention other sites, we all do it as needed.
But, when it is possible - we like to post the information here on LTBBQ, and absolutely give credit to the original post and website. This helps to build the LTBBQ data base so that we can continue growing the content.
Again - and this is the important ( and often misunderstood ) part: We MUST give credit to the original poster/website. So, don't worry about mentioning other sites, we are ALL members of several forums. We are not anti- other forums here ;D. What our House Rules try to explain is the difference between mentioning, and promoting. Promoting is usually pretty obvious. I did not see that your post was promoting - it was pointing to good information, specific to the discussion. Still, whenever possible, copy and paste here - and give credit to the site where it came from, and even post the link to the original post.
So, Dan, sorry for the confusion, we are trying to refine the policies so that they protect LTBBQ and you all as members. It is our goal to create 1 place that you can find most of the useful for outdoor cooking.
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A side note on the money muscle. As a KCBS Judge, if I see a turn-in box without the money muscle presented with the pulled pork, the first thing I look for/"taste" for is "is this pulled pork over cooked". It simply raises a flag on that competitor's box. I have had boxes without the money muscle that were really outstanding. These competitors may have been relatively new and not aware of the "power" of the money muscle.
Art
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From a competitor and judge: Not all that many years ago the pork category of KCBS competitions was pretty much all pulled or chopped pork. Although this can look delicious, it pretty much all looks the same from box to box at the judges' table. To stand out and make their boxes more attractive, some cooks started slicing the money muscle (well described above) into "medallions" and glazing them to create interest. This caught on in a hurry and nowadays, almost every pork box I see is composed of both pulled or chopped (sometimes both) meat along with money muscle medallions. The term "money muscle" was born from it tendency to almost always be quite flavorful, tender and attractive thus providing more oomph toward prize money :D
Hub
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Well said Hub & ACW3. The money muscle can be a great addition to pulled pork turn in boxes, both from a visual standpoint and give something else for judges to taste. I think a pork box that just has a pile of pulled meat in it is not very visually appealing, but I would never score it down from an appearance standpoint since the rule says "judge what is presented."
Having said that, as a competitor, you can do a lot more with sliced money muscle in a turn in box. I also like to eat sliced or chunked money muscle as it is usually very tender and flavorful.
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ACW3 & Hub, as a judge can I get your input. The new KCBS rule that is instated for 2014, I'll be honest, I strongly dislike...no I hate it. As a pitmaster, the challenge of these KCBS competitions are about smoking and BBQ, not a grilling competition. This is just my opinion, but I think most people are truly going to focus on strictly money muscle in the box. Do you like the array of options? It's tough as a competitor because you don't know who your judges are and what their preference is. I've talked to some that hates sliced pork but love pulled. I hate talked to some the hate pulled and love sliced and chunks. My box usually consists of pulled, slices, chunks, and plugs. Does this many options hurt or help me?
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ACW3 & Hub, as a judge can I get your input. The new KCBS rule that is instated for 2014, I'll be honest, I strongly dislike...no I hate it. As a pitmaster, the challenge of these KCBS competitions are about smoking and BBQ, not a grilling competition. This is just my opinion, but I think most people are truly going to focus on strictly money muscle in the box. Do you like the array of options? It's tough as a competitor because you don't know who your judges are and what their preference is. I've talked to some that hates sliced pork but love pulled. I hate talked to some the hate pulled and love sliced and chunks. My box usually consists of pulled, slices, chunks, and plugs. Does this many options hurt or help me?
The "old" rule was inducing a great deal of sameness in the pork category. The intent of the change is to induce some creativity. Whether it will work or not I don't know. However, I'm willing to see what turns up. Both judges and cooks will have to adapt and get used to some different approaches. That causes trouble for some. I've heard a few cooks say they won't make any changes to their recipes or approaches immediately and that makes some sense if one has been consistently getting walks.
As I wrote in one of my Bull Sheet articles last fall, there is a somewhat numbing "contest style" of food that has evolved and those who get too far away from its dictates often do so at their own peril because judges, too, are in the same rut. So, for now, I'm hopeful we'll see an increased level of creativity in the pork category. If we don't (and that could happen) then the change will have been a noble experiment nonetheless.
My advice: Hide and watch. If you're already producing good pork you really have nothing to fear. It is as likely to get good scores as it ever has, at least in the short run. In the long run, if the rule holds, we'll see at best some interesting variations or, at worst, another "contest style" develop. The jury is out ;)
Hub
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Lots of discussion of the money muscle which I'm greatly enjoying.
A member on a another site posted some good pics and description that may of helped. Unfortunately I was unable to find it :(
I did find more questions;
How to properly prepare a Butt for smoking, this can either be for the home or comp cook.
The Gland how to locate and remove.
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Pork Boxes
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v230/OldDave/PorkPresentation.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v230/OldDave/GoodPorkPresentation.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v230/OldDave/Contest%20Cooking/ISSPORK2.jpg)
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WOW! Dave. That looks fantastic and now you've got my stomach growling and gurgling! I know it tastes as good as it looks. Nice job.
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Hopefully I get quoting thing right without breaking rules, but I just want to educate those asking and keep it here too.
CDN, to answer one of your questions, the first picture (from Sausagemaker.com) attached is that bitter gland on a bone in butt. You definitely want to make sure you cut that one out; it's nasty. There's also a vein along the top of the Money muscle that you want to get out too. To answer your next question about how to prepare a pork butt for home or competition is going to be more questions. When I cook at home, I don't cook like I do in competitions because of rules, which changed this year and I'm still playing with that. When it comes to competition, you need to understand how this meat breaks down. There are muscles such as:
-Money Muscle
-Horn (shown in the third picture from Bill Anderson of www.bbqsuccess.com)
-Tubes (shown in the second picture from a master bbq teacher Malcom Reed of Killer Hogs)
-Loin
-Flower
Each of these muscles has a different flavor and texture. When I cook for a competition, I cook 3 sometimes 4 butts, each of them has their own purpose. Money muscles are sliceable at one temp (190-194), pulled is ready at 198-204 (depending on the butt), tubes are done at another temp depending on how you want to present them. I have gotten to the point where if managed properly and cooked properly, you can manage 2 butts and still beat some of the best out there. We've walked quite a bit in pork this past year and I don't plan on changing anything. When it comes to home, I slice off the money muscle completely and cook it separate from the rest of the butt. One thing that I can tell you is buy a bone-in butt, throw on a pair of gloves, and use your hands to show you the break down of a pork butt. Many times you only need a knife to trim off the fat. And remember that bark is your friend, expose that red meat and season it up, get some pink smoke rings on that meat. If it's white, cut it off. Smoke and rub can't penetrate fat, it just renders off. Probably more than you wanted, but there's so much to learn about pork.
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Thanks for the pics Dave I was going to ask if anyone had some box photos. They look awesome ;D
Bigdaddydan,
Can never have enough information. The more you take in hopefully some will stick.
I'm not new to smoking forums but pointing out the vein and why it needs to be removed it new to me. I don't remember anyone talking about this before.
You have passed along a lot of info to research and absorb. I'm sure I will have a few more questions.
What I'm doing now is taking the bone in butt, trimming the fat cap down to about 1/4", Injecting and rub. I have tried the foil but Honey don't like the bark so I refrain from foiling. Honey gets what's honey wants if CDN wants toys without noise ;D
I will still inject but I will try your idea of taking all the fat off to produce a better bark.
Many Thanks and Greatly Appreciated,
CDN
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Hopefully I get quoting thing right without breaking rules, but I just want to educate those asking and keep it here too.
CDN, to answer one of your questions, the first picture (from Sausagemaker.com) attached is that bitter gland on a bone in butt. You definitely want to make sure you cut that one out; it's nasty. There's also a vein along the top of the Money muscle that you want to get out too. To answer your next question about how to prepare a pork butt for home or competition is going to be more questions. When I cook at home, I don't cook like I do in competitions because of rules, which changed this year and I'm still playing with that. When it comes to competition, you need to understand how this meat breaks down. There are muscles such as:
-Money Muscle
-Horn (shown in the third picture from Bill Anderson of www.bbqsuccess.com)
-Tubes (shown in the second picture from a master bbq teacher Malcom Reed of Killer Hogs)
-Loin
-Flower
Each of these muscles has a different flavor and texture. When I cook for a competition, I cook 3 sometimes 4 butts, each of them has their own purpose. Money muscles are sliceable at one temp (190-194), pulled is ready at 198-204 (depending on the butt), tubes are done at another temp depending on how you want to present them. I have gotten to the point where if managed properly and cooked properly, you can manage 2 butts and still beat some of the best out there. We've walked quite a bit in pork this past year and I don't plan on changing anything. When it comes to home, I slice off the money muscle completely and cook it separate from the rest of the butt. One thing that I can tell you is buy a bone-in butt, throw on a pair of gloves, and use your hands to show you the break down of a pork butt. Many times you only need a knife to trim off the fat. And remember that bark is your friend, expose that red meat and season it up, get some pink smoke rings on that meat. If it's white, cut it off. Smoke and rub can't penetrate fat, it just renders off. Probably more than you wanted, but there's so much to learn about pork.
You have won the "Post of the Day Award" Dan! ;D
Awesome job - and look at what great info you brought to LTBBQ. Quality members...Quality information. Nice how that goes together - huh? ;)
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Wow, didn't see that coming at all. Thank you Teesquare. Just trying to help answer someone's questions to the best of my ability with giving away too many of our trade secrets.
CDN Smoker, for myself I don't trim down the fat cap except for under the horn and the money muscle. I could understand the bark part, have you tried wrapping in butchers paper. It softens the bark just a hint because it breaths, but still does close to what the foil does.
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Bigdaddydan, in the 2nd picture. Is the money muscle to the left of the tubes?
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What unbelievable information. Much more than I ever knew existed.
I want this to be a demonstration at the Fall Gathering this year. ( I should have a date within a week or so). So, hopefully someone who understands this can give us some instruction in person. Uncle Dave, you up to that?
Dee
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This is great info, I never know there was so much to a pork butt. Now I have something new to try.
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Bigdaddydan, in the 2nd picture. Is the money muscle to the left of the tubes?
That is the money muscle to the left of the tube. Not the best picture of a money muscle from a side cut perspective, but in comparison to location yes.
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Old Dave the pics of pork in those boxes are just beautiful.