Nutrition Science

[LostArrow]

At this point in time nutrition science at best is an educated guess........at worst like witches reading signs from their caldron
Don't read too much into " News releases" of recent studies.
As Socrates said "everything in moderation , nothing in excess "

[sliding_billy]

Just remember that everyone who does research has an agenda.

[spuds]

True we have a LOT to learn,and know very little.Always amazes me we think we know it all,we know so little.

To be factual studies need to be backed up by others and repeatable by others,one is useless IMO.But I do believe in repeatable research with consistent numbers done by many sources.I dont believe its all agenda,true scientists dont go into studies to prove THEIR preconceived notion,they accept what comes out without bias.A lot of honest researchers without their egos getting in their way,done without industry backing.

But staying on top of it is important,and keeping an open mind,and changing your views when more info is proffered is essential.Keeping a frozen closed mind,like we tend to do when we KNOW something,and not seeing contrary solid evidence,drives me nuts. Peoples who set their opinions in 1970 and are incapable of seeing anything else,makes me crazy,but so be it.I just cant hang with them.Professional Health organizations are the worst in that regard,their livelihoods are related to their standards as they see it.Heart assoc,Diabetic assoc are terrible in their inability to accept and admit they are wrong.

Of course,IMO,if you want to drink battery acid its your right and none of my business,its not up to me to make your health choices,its your body,your RIGHT,contrary to what many think,thats my take on it.

I think the safest diet is one thats varied,you are sure to get what you need that way.

[spuds]

The thing is,research is available from the entire world,at your fingertips,from your couch.This is a major game changer,bringing knowledge thats incredibly easy to access,never been possible,ever ,before.

Now even us schmucks can access it all,mostly,what a great thing.

And I for one am loving it.

[teesquare]

While it is possible that "all research" has an agenda.....let's not use it as an excuse to marginalize  such information. I think our interests are served best by examining as much of the credible studies out there and using a rational, resonable analysis to digest such information.
We can't know too much......but we can ignore too much.
The process of tempering all of the data with reasonable reaction to it- is the time consumptive....but most valuable to us in so far as long term health is concerned.

[sliding_billy]

While it is possible that "all research" has an agenda.....let's not use it as an excuse to marginalize  such information. I think our interests are served best by examining as much of the credible studies out there and using a rational, resonable analysis to digest such information.
We can't know too much......but we can ignore too much.
The process of tempering all of the data with reasonable reaction to it- is the time consumptive....but most valuable to us in so far as long term health is concerned.

The problem is that people mistakenly treat research and hypotheses as understanding and fact.

[spuds]

SB,I agree to a point with what you say.But if you put 2 groups,on different diets,and the results are repeatable and come out the same in a majority of studies,I find the conclusions fairly reliable.

[sliding_billy]

SB,I agree to a point with what you say.But if you put 2 groups,on different diets,and the results are repeatable and come out the same in a majority of studies,I find the conclusions fairly reliable.

Depends on what results you are looking at.  Short term, long term, weight, body fat, other measures...

[spuds]

SB,I agree to a point with what you say.But if you put 2 groups,on different diets,and the results are repeatable and come out the same in a majority of studies,I find the conclusions fairly reliable.

Depends on what results you are looking at.  Short term, long term, weight, body fat, other measures...

Yup,depends on the study what results they are measuring?

Its up to each of us to find validity or not from studies.Our choice? doesnt make either group right if we choose to find studies useful or not,but if not,how do you get any sort of knowledge base to make any decisions?

[sliding_billy]

I think we are agreeing.  What I was saying is that people see an authoritative source (news, science, journalism) and then put their blinders on to the fact that the source may be an idiot or a salesman.  People are lemmings.  Yes, I am a skeptic.  The fact that you use information in the proper way makes me happy.  Being able to distinguish information from op ed is the key.

[LostArrow]

Even without agendas they are studying people.
You can't cage them & only feed them "purina people chow". For 20 years.
Self reporting on diet is notoriously full of error.
Then throw in all the other variables of genetics, climate, exercise, alcohol, smoking & others and it's very hard to study.

[africanmeat]

Just remember that everyone who does research has an agenda.

X2

[muebe]

People are so different and there are so many variables that most "studies" don't really catch my attention. But any of them that say beer is good for you I am in 100% agreement

You got one person who smokes and drinks heavily all their life and manages to live until 90. Then you got the guy who eats right and exercises then gets cancer at 35.

No matter how much science tries to conquer our final destination the fact is Mother Nature finds a way to keep us from over populating the earth! The more science keeps us alive the more the population of the earth grows

Look you give a lab rat the equivalent of a 1000 times what a human would consume of something they are bound to get some kind of ailment.

Heck... You can die from drinking too much water!

Listen to your doctor and not a bunch of studies! Enjoy things in life in moderation.

[spuds]

Listen to your doctor and not a bunch of studies! Enjoy things in life in moderation.

Yikes,worked with Dr's too long,like 40 years and many many many rate right up there with sleazy lawyers and used car salesman. I LIKE my Dr,that said he is a pill pusher and his answer to everything is another pill.Thats the majority of Dr's Ive worked with,and Ive worked with a lot.

And talk about behind the times on current knowledge,scare the livin hell out of me.Most get all their info from drug companies and medical reps selling something,and professional journals with studies paid for from industry.Thats how it is.

When you add in Dr's that will run endless uncalled for tests and procedures to enrich themselves and their buddies,they are everywhere. So far from Saints its ridiculous.From personal experience and I'll bet most folks with 40 years of the system feel the same.And have seen it too.

The goal is not to cure you,its to lessen your symptoms and keep you in the system,if they cured you,you wouldnt need them,and their very lucrative gravy trains comes to a screeching halt.Sorry,but thats what medicine is all about.

So true,esp with cancer treatments for example,you need an unconnected second opinion,and then a third! Your Dr will give you ONLY the choices he,his hospital or his buddies do,anything thing else SUX they will tell you,yup,self serving Dr's are everywhere!Im not saying go witch Dr,I am saying there is more than one way to treat illness,you need to know it and YOU,the educated patient,needs to make the decision,not someone with an economic agenda.

I got news for you.1 Mercedes is never enough,I know Drs with a car stable with Ferrari's and beach homes,helicopters!,its never enough,dont let that creep decide what best for you without realizing its whats best for HIM first,yup,that happens,always has,hysterectomies used to be the big scam until cat scans put that BS out of business.They have plenty more.

Educate YOURSELF,only YOU is looking out for YOUR best interests,then CHOOSE the options that are available,blind faith will screw you under terribly.

Yeah,its a rant,but Ive been in the system since I was a 17 year old corpsman,I dont let them pull any of that trash on my family.

[spuds]

People are so different ....
. Then you got the guy who eats right and exercises then gets cancer at 35.

You got one person who smokes and drinks heavily all their life and manages to live until 90

Thats true,but its also the exception and studies will bear that out,how insurance companies can accurately insure you for life insurance and remain profitable.

Then you got the guy who eats right and exercises then gets cancer at 35

Also true,but again statistics are readily available,accurate,and will clearly show you thats an anomaly,not the rule.

Odds greatly favor you will be the average,not the exception,and thats shown by statistical data,ie,death rates and diagnosis and ages is readily available,fairly darn accurate,and over the population as a whole very prognostic.