Let's Talk BBQ
Outdoor Cooking Equipment => Grills & Smokers => Stick Burners => Topic started by: veryolddog on June 06, 2013, 06:18:27 PM
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Hi everyone,
On the way back from the VA in San Antonio today, we stopped in the Academy Sports off of I35 in Schertz. While my wife was browsing for exercise clothing, I went over to look at the smoker. They had about 20 Old Country Smokers lined up. The first one that I looked at was the Brazos model and it was heavy. It was at least a 1/4 inch thick all the way around and looked a 1/2 inch or 3/8's of an inch in some areas, had flanged doors and huge. The price was $1,000.00. Then they had a bunch of Pecos models that were about 3/16 of an inch and nicely put together. They also had a smaller model called the wrangler, which was about a 1/4 inch thick and with flanged lids on the firebox and the main grill.That unit was priced at $500.00. It was built like a small Sherman Tank. It had two shelves, the top being a slide out, heat baffle in the interior, pot warmer and grill over the firebox. I would think that you could get a charcoal grill plate for the main grill and use it as a direct grilling area. I am very impressed with this piece of equipment because for the price, they sure give you big piece of thick steel.
The Pecos model which I think Jaxon has is pretty solid as well but this Wrangler model is heavier and thicker.
Two concerns: how good is this welded together? and how evenly in this smoker would heat be distributed from the firebox side to the stack side? Is there going to be a 50 degree temperature swing and will modifications have to be made to add a steel plate from the baffle to the other end to get the heat even across the top? Are they made in Mexico?
You guys got me talking like I know what I am talking about.
That is a very nice unit and you probably cannot go wrong for the money.
With kind regards,
Ed
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Don't know about the craftsmanship of the Old Country.
I do know two things about it:
They are made in Mexico and sold in Texas.
Jaxon has one and he likes his a bunch.
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Ken - 2pockets- works at Academic Sports. When I started talking about the Wrangler, he directed me to the Pecos, telling me that the cooking area was larger than the Wrangler. Of course, he mentioned the double shelf, which might come in handy for a double load of ribs or wings (things that lie flatter on the grate). Howsomever, he didn't seem to think I would be able to double-stack butts on the 2 shelves. I was looking' for a pretty substantial smoker with a fairly large cooking surface on a budget.
Yep...I'm STILL happy I listened to him and STILL happy with the Pecos.
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Jaxon: you are absolutely correct. For metal they are the same. And you do get a lot more space on the Pecos, but for some reason I cannot identify, the Wrangler is a $100 more.
After seeing them first hand and looking at the the Char Broils, there is no comparison.
I saw your video but the up front and personal view of this product is impressive for price performance category that this product resides in.
Good Choice!!!!!
If anyone has a price point under $400.00, this is a good purchase. Someone could have a field day with a few mods.
Regards,
Ed
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The Old Country smokers are very substantial and very well made. The only problem I have seen is that sometimes you may have a lid that doesn't fit entirely flush and might leak smoke, but since they are totally welded and assembled when you buy them, don't get one that everything is not fitting well. I have returned smokers to them that were not flush and fitting well and they sent us out new ones that were good. They have some good features in that there is a baffle inside the cooking chamber that spreads out the heat and smoke coming from the smoke box and the exhaust from the cooking chamber sits down at grill level instead of up high so it keeps the smoke and heat down at the meat level.
The company is in Laredo, TX and their manufactoring facility is two miles across the border in Neuvo Laredo Mexico. The smokers that Academy sells are sort of at the lower end of their products but still very well made. They make big trailer units also. Without abuse these smokers can be passed down to your kids and maybe your grandkids.
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I don't think you could find another off-set made with 1/4" steel under 500.00..it is just unheard of........
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I think that you are also correct, Smoke. In my research about alternatives with respect to wood smokers, I found this place in Ulvade, Texas, Texas Longhorn BBQ Pits, which sells a 16 inch made from 1/4 basic model for $589. However you have to add thermometer and extras. The one that I priced came to $729. He provides a 15 per cent discount to all Law Enforcement, Firefighters and military. This brings the price down to $620. If you bought the barebones 16, with the discount, it would be $500.00. That is standard with a baffle off of the firebox and no thermometer. That is the only one that I can see close to the $500.00 target. But it took a little bit of searching to find him.
I am going out to Uvalde next week to look at them. Just as I was impressed with the weight and fit and finish of the Old Country that Jaxon purchased, I would like to see this first hand and see what else this fellow can do.
I purchased the Yoder sight unseen based upon the reviews by folks on a variety of sites and the Yoder reputation. I felt very comfortable with this decision and I still do based upon my real life experience. And, it is built like a tank.
regards,
Ed
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Give Lilian a call over at bbq pits by JJ and tell her smoochy sent ya........they are in Houston.....
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There is a very good thread on Smoking-Meat forums that came up today about the Old Country Wrangler model that I thought would be interesting for anyone who wishes to review.
http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/t/142246/old-country-bbq-pits-wrangler-smoker-review
You know, this really appears to be a nice budget conscience product for those who would like to spend approximately $500.00 with some realistic modifications. However, as it is pointed out in the thread, the advice is to really look carefully at the product you will purchase with a keen eye.
And, considering that Academy Sports has quite a few stores, this offers a lot of people the opportunity to get into wood smoking that have never been there before. It is a good thing. I am impressed.
Regards,
Ed
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Ed, If I were you and unless you just like putting stuff together, I would have AS put it together for me. I always have my stuff assembled because I don't like doing it and if there is something wrong they catch it during the assembly. Dee
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I think the Old Country line is all welded. I think the biggest challenge will be getting it to the back yard.
The nice thing about Academy having a bunch of stores so you can come by and kick the tires..............
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Hi everyone,
I have not made any purchase at this time. I do look favorably upon the Old Country product. For $85.00 they will bring it to the house and put it where I want, so that is not a bad price for the delivery. I could never budge that thing.
I guess my point is: a lot of people are really beginning to enjoy a new level of outdoor cooking especially the avenue of smoking. People enter outdoor cooking usually with a charcoal grill and then migrate to a gas grill which serves their purpose for many years. Then all of a sudden, some folks are introduced to smoked food via one avenue or another. And, now these folks are entering a path in which the marketplace has responded with a wide variety of alternatives. The marketplace, thanks to a wonderful capitalistic society and not a socialist one (Sorry, I could not help myself) present alternatives in a variety of ways according to price, performance and quality depending upon the budgets of a variety of households. I personally think that it is great that there is so much choice and that a lot of people are beginning to appreciate this kind of cooking not only for feeding their families quality BBQ but also entertainment and hobby. The Old Country Product line fits a market segment of that criteria.
I have been smoking for five years, not as long as most people on this forum. I started with a $150.00 propane smoker. I enjoyed it. I then purchased an MES 30 for $289.00. I enjoyed that too. Then I purchased the Yoder for $1375.00 including the shipping and the bells and whistles. I enjoy that very much. I have come to learn that smoking and BBQ for me is both fun and entertaining. The product is really outstanding. So, rather than replace a smoker, I want to purchase an additional smoker just so that I can experience and use wood and charcoal and have fun doing that. It is a hobby which, at this age, provides some fulfillment. And, there are a lot worse ways to spend your money.
I have looked at 3 different products in 3 different price ranges. I do want quality and as you know it, you have to pay for quality. However, I am looking for something that is relatively budget conscience that has solid quality attributes. I feel that the Old Country, Wrangler model ($500.00), the Texas Longhorns BBQ Pit TL-11 ($600.00), and the Texas Pitcrafters PM-75 ($800.00) would all do the job for me AT MY LEVEL OF EXPECTATION. To be very candid, I want to spend the least amount of money to get the highest quality that I can and I believe that everyone out there shares this same sentiment. That is why I am leaning very strongly to the Texas Longhorns BBQ Pit. This fellow is a small businessman, who runs a small shop making quality BBQ pits for low prices. Everything is 1/4 inch steel and he is meticulous in fit and finish. I can purchase his pit with a 15 per cent discount for $600.00 which includes a full length tuning plate similar to the heat managment plate in the Yoder or a solid plate or 3 equally cut solid plates, two thermometers, a baffle installed where the heat management plate will join the firebox and the smoke stack at the grill level for $600.00. Delivery wood be $125.00 from Uvalde which is 115 miles from New Braunfels.
If I had a wheel barrel full of money rolled up to my door every month, or won the Power Ball, I would make probably a different decision. But I do not live that way. I have always been conservative when it comes to money.When I started to think about retirement back in 1972, I thought that I could live well on $60,000 per year. I did not realize that this is Horse Manure. And frankly, I did not expect to live this long. During the course of the years, I have had to readjust my thinking for expected levels of expenses. So even though we have money, and we live on a budget, I have to think about how my wife is going to live after I am gone. I really do not worry about the children. Just like everyone, we all have choices to make and we make those choices for different reasons all personal to us as individuals.
For that reason, I do not hold my nose up because someone chooses a Char-Broil Smoker or and MES 30, or whatever brand that fits their criteria. I think that it is great that they are enjoying the experience.
And, that is that.
With kind regards,
Ed
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Ed, I had two thoughts as I read your excellent post. First, I would like to buy from someone I can meet face to face and form a relationship with if their quality and price are competitive with the others I'm looking at. Second, we here all love what we are doing and continue to expand our horizons. The question comes to mind of are we passing this love and skill on to others? I would hope we have taken someone under our wing and mentoring them in this great world in which we call ''outdoor cooking" for lack of a better term. Are any of y'all out there doing any mentoring? How's it going? Dee
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Ed, if you are looking for a off-set that gives you the most bang for the buck it is the Old Country hands down, game over, end of story.
There is no other off-set that is all welded with that thick of steel on the market for 300-500 smackers....you probably already know that after doing all your research :)
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THE SAGA CONTINUES:
So, I ventured forth with tape measure in hand down to Academy Sports today to really look at the Old Country Smokers. I really wanted to see the differences in the models and understand why they were priced that way. My objective, if I found the Wrangler model to be acceptable, was to put it on order and have it delivered.
This is what I found:
The Brazos model priced for $1,000.00 is 1/4 inch thick.
The Wrangler model priced for $500.00 is 3/16 inch thick.
The Pecos model priced for $400.00 is 1/8 inch thick.
The Rancher model priced for $300.00 is 1/16 inch thick.
Now, if Jaxon picked up a Pecos that is 3/16 inch thick, he did well because the one in the Academy Sports in Shertz was only 1/8 inch thick. It is conceivable that Old Country changed its criteria to increase its profit on that model and to keep it priced at $400.00.
Fit and finish was inconsistent on the Old Country models. There were two Pecos models there. The door to the main grill fit very nicely and smooth on one and the other was pushed out a little indicating to me that there may be leakage of both heat and smoke from this area. The Wrangler model that I was interested in had a similar issue on the right hand corner of the main grill door. I did not understand why the left hand side closed very nicely and the right hand side was raised up a little more. Then I opened that grill and removed the main grill grate and reclosed the door. The main door closed nice and smooth on both sides. I showed this to the sales person of the department and he concurred. I told him that if this could be corrected, I would purchase the grill. Tomorrow, he is going to call Old Country and see if they can get a new grill grate so that the door will close properly. It looks like that grill grate could be 1/2 to 1 inch shorter. Just a note, all of the doors on the fireboxes of all of the models closed very nicely.
The best fit and finish of all of the units on display was the Brazos. This is the model that is $1,000.00 and 1/4 inch thick. I would think that if Old Country enhanced its quality control at the factory, they would be producing a higher quality unit to the public. But, everything is for profit and volume makes profit. I should have asked them if they wanted to sell that $1,000.00 unit for $750.00. It is bigger than I need, but I would have done it.
So tomorrow, I am going to a local butcher shop that sells grills only 3 miles from my home. It is called Granzin's market. They have Lyfe Tyme and one other brand of Texas smokers. They had a bunch of units in April but they were not open today to take a look. Tomorrow, I will stop there first and then head up to the Academy in San Marcos which is 10 miles up I35 and look at the Wrangler that they have in stock. It feels like a crap shoot. I know that Lyfe Tyme is not cheap and, at this point in time, Old Country is a 50-50 chance of finding one that has a decent fit and finish. And, after a Wrangler or any unit is purchased, then you still need to add a tuning plate for even temperature and heat distribution. At least I know by bringing my measure that i could have a welder or a machine shop provide me with three 1/4 inch plates that are 4 inches X 15 3/4 inches and place these in the unit from the baffle to the chimney stack or I could have one piece of metal 1/4 inch x 12 inches x 15 3/4 inches that would do the same job. In that case I could drill holes in that single sheet.
Ah.....tomorrow is another day.
Regards,
Ed
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So, is Texas Pit Crafters out of the running?? For your information, the fire-box on them is 3/16 and the smoking chamber is 12 gauge.
Lyfe-Time is a nice pit.......but if you find an Old Country in person that you like the build on....get it and get it quickly...(http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc469/s1cott11/funny%20icons/twocents.gif) (http://s1213.photobucket.com/user/s1cott11/media/funny%20icons/twocents.gif.html)
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Sometimes all the metal can be not such a good thing. The thick metal can make pre-heating take longer and when the wind blows across it cooling it more thermal energy is required for it to re-heat.
You obviously do not want it thin metal but really thick gauge is not needed IMHO unless you plan on shooting at it ;)
I think weld quality and how air tight the off-set is very important.
Don't forget that weight can be an issue when you need to move the smoker around.
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Thanks for the feedback guys,
Weight is an issue and either delivery or support from my son is mandatory. There is no way that I could physically move something like that.
I just returned from a place called Buc ee's. It is the largest gas station ever. Inside is like a market and they sell all kinds of things including smokers. They had an a smoker made by All Seasons Feeders. It is 3/16 of an inch and priced at $695.00. This unit looks like the Pitcrafters with a 24 x 24 firebox. Some of the features of this pit are:
• Wood rack
• 24x24 Fire box
• Air cooled spring handle
• Casters, for easy relocation
• Grease drain and hook for bucket
• Pre-threaded hole for temperature gauge
• Heat transfer shield with adjustable baffles
• Slide out grills and ash trays for easy clean out
• Liquid reservoir evaporator for beer, apple juice or water
• Made of 3/16 Gauge Steel
Here's a few pictures of the All Seasons,
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/Allseasons2.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/Allseasons2.jpg.html)
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/Allseasons3.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/Allseasons3.jpg.html)
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/Allseasons4.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/Allseasons4.jpg.html)
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/Allseasons1.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/Allseasons1.jpg.html)
I have to pick up and bring home as they do not deliver. They also have another smoker called the Wilkes BBQ Pit which is 1/4 inch thick and they are priced at $771.00.
I still like the Old Country Wrangler at $500.00. Something about the price and the size is perfect for me. I still would have to add a tuning plate.
i will make my two stops tomorrow and see if they have anything.
Regards,
Ed
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I would suggest not adding a tuning plate until after some cooks, ya might not need it............
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Last evening, I am sitting here trying to watch Pirates of the Caribbean - on stranger tides and I am totally frustrated at trying to find a quality wood smoker for $500 to $650.00. I looked at Old Country, Texas Longhorn, Wilkes, Texas Original BBQ Pits, All Seasons, B & R Custom Pits, Texas Pitcrafters, Gator Pits, Klose Pits, Lang, and a few more that I can't remember to mention. I can't find the price and I can't find the quality with fit and finish. except if you want to pay$900.00 plus dollars base price. On top of that there are options that you want such as a thermometer, tuning plate, charcoal grill plate, etc. This adds $150.00 or more to the cost. And, lastly, there is shipping and getting it into my backyard on the patio.
I want to buy something and not have to worry about quality, fit and finish, and whether or not this thing is going to do the job. I want it delivered. I want it to work correctly. I do not want to be sorry about my decision. I am frustrated, I am pissed, and I am angry at myself because the alternatives are narrow and that I will have to settle for less. Even my Golden, looks at me funny and the cat avoids eye contact and gives me a wide berth.
So, last night, at about 11:00 PM, I wrote Don Cary and email and told him that I wanted to order a Yoder Cheyenne with a heat management plate and charcoal grate for the main chamber. Total price is $941.00 plus $110.00 for shipping. Don responded to me this morning at 6:38 AM and we have a deal. Now, I am going to have two Yoders on my patio.
I afraid that I got to the point where I did not want to settle for less after seeing what is on the market. Yes, there are others like Gator and Klose that produce outstanding quality pits, but, they are more expensive and do not have a small Unit like the Cheyenne. Having purchased the Yoder YS 480 in May, and seeing it in operation and the quality of the unit, there is no doubt in my mind that I will be shipped a nice unit. I do not want to live with that doubt if another brand were selected. I like Yoder quality.
So, that is the end of this story. I am over my objective by about $400.00 but, over the long haul (a few years) that would not make a difference anyway.
Here are a few pictures of the Yoder Cheyenne:
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/Cheyenne01.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/Cheyenne01.jpg.html)
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/cheyenne10.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/cheyenne10.jpg.html)
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/cheyenne05.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/cheyenne05.jpg.html)
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/cheyenne04.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/cheyenne04.jpg.html)
(http://i1120.photobucket.com/albums/l494/edsigman/cheyenne11.jpg) (http://s1120.photobucket.com/user/edsigman/media/cheyenne11.jpg.html)
So, now at Thanksgiving or Christmas, I can see my self making a turkey on the YS 480 and a brisket on the Cheyenne. Whatever. I probably will alternate usage and for all high heat use the Cheyenne.
I feel much better.
With kind regards,
Ed
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I empathize with the gyrations you've been going through! However, that is one very nice looking cooker! There will always be trade-offs in any decision, and you clearly thought yours out before pulling the trigger. While the flat top is probably a good thing for warming the wood - I bet a clever guy could find a work around... ;) Good for you on getting the cooker you are looking for!
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You couldn't have made a better choice than a Yoder. Yoder and Horizon are off-shoots of the legendary Oklahoma Joe's outfit.........congratulations.........
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Ed, I concur with your decision. TT brought his Yoder pellet-pooper to Augusta last Fall and when I saw the quality, I Knew they made excellent cookers.
Now that the decision is made...go pet the cat and scratch the dog.
As for the flat-top for pre-heating wood...dang, you have enuff room in the chamber to put a log IF you want to pre-heat (totally optional). I have put some wood inside mine right there against the right-hand side. I don't cook anything on that side anyway.
Can't wait to see what new tricks an "old dog" can do with his new offset.
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Great call Jaxon. Just put your min-splits in the smoking chamber..but not to close to the fire-box side...
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Well, Capn. you may have just saved my life...I won't do THAT again.
B T W, a couple of weeks ago I ALMOST had a piece of wood catch fire on that flat. I had to laff because I remembered you warning me about it - or was it Smoke - there were some glowing red spots on the bottom when I got to it. ;D
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That was me Jaxon. I had em just burst into flames on me. If you had an electric smoker Jaxon, you could just stack your wood in it and heat em that way.........
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Like I said... a clever fella will find a work around... ;) ;D
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That's a really nice Yoder, I Think you did your due diligence on finding the right fit for you :) Just been watching as I know nothing about cookin in one of them besides watching Jaxon on his awesome videos :) Congrats!!
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That Yoder is a beauty!
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The Yoder Cheyenne ships on June 18th. I would have thought that since it was ordered on June 10th that it would have shipped on Friday. However, one can speculate that these folks are pretty busy people getting a lot of orders out the door or they have to build the unit to get it out the door and have no inventory.
The last time when I ordered the YS 480, it was shipped on a Friday and we received delivery on that next Wednesday which really is not that bad. It came to the house via FedEX truck with a lift gate which I suspect that this will also be true. Then they rolled it up the driveway into the garage. Then I will send for the boys to get it off of the pallet. However, I was thinking that if I put enough 2 x 4's across the pallet, with those big wheels, it might be easier to roll it across the pallet to the edge of the pallet. Then I can step down 2 x 4's to get it on the concrete floor. This sounds very plausible for a 40 year old guy. I can see my self being dragged down the drive way to the street as this thing takes off all 340 lbs. of it. LOL. I should have my wife video tape this.
As a matter of fact, I should look at video taping the receipt of the unit and the unpacking and putting together of the unit. And then the break in process. I have to figure out how to use that video camera again.
Regards,
Ed
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Ed due to the economy most companies that manufacture keep much less inventory on hand and build as they sell. I am sure this is the case with Yoder too.
A video would be great! Maybe you should have Jaxon come and film it for you ;)
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YES!!!
Will film for food...
Lemme know.
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Thanks to Ed telling us about Old Country smokers and Jaxon's excellent videos, I pulled the trigger on a Old Country Wrangler. The Pecos is not available on-line anymore. I spoke to a very nice young lady at an Academy store in Katy, Texas and she measured the Wrangler for me and really helped me out. In fact, I got the Wrangler for 399.99 with 89.00 freight shipping to my door........just unheard of......once Eric comes by with the Yoder Abilene, I will be all set from here on out...
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Thanks to Ed telling us about Old Country smokers and Jaxon's excellent videos, I pulled the trigger on a Old Country Wrangler. The Pecos is not available on-line anymore. I spoke to a very nice young lady at an Academy store in Katy, Texas and she measured the Wrangler for me and really helped me out. In fact, I got the Wrangler for 399.99 with 89.00 freight shipping to my door........just unheard of......once Eric comes by with the Yoder Abilene, I will be all set from here on out...
I think you might buy and sell more smokers & grills than Eric does Smoke! San Fernando Pellet and Smoker Suppliers should be your store name ???
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For some reason, Eric hasn't offered me a job yet. I figure my last vacation was in 1994, so my patio is my vacation destination these days............